RUSSELL BISSET: Welcome back to the Fresh From The North podcast.

This show is a celebration of some of the North's freshest, most interesting, most dynamic humans with me, Russell Bisset of Northern Monk.

Thanks to everyone that's listened so far, we've had some great feedback and some great reviews. If you can leave a review on whatever podcasting platform you use, please do so. It means the world to us. We're super grateful.

Today we're speaking to someone that was absolutely at, and is at, the top of his game, someone that really conquered their chosen profession, a profession that’s a real icon of Northern culture.

That person is Jamie Peacock, and he is one of the most decorated rugby league players ever.

His story is one of triumph over adversity. It's one of coming from humble beginnings. And it's one of life’s lessons that apply to every single one of us really, that's out trying to achieve something in life.

I found it really powerful. I hope you do too. Thanks as ever to my dad for this intro and outro. I think if you listen carefully, the end outro music of Liz Cottom's episode, I think you might get to listen to my dad chant “Dauphinoise” in a Gregorian fashion.

It doesn't get fresher than that, but if you want stuff that's fresh from the north, you're in the right place.

Without further ado, this is Jamie Peacock Fresh From The North.

RUSSELL BISSET: First and foremost, Jamie, thank you so much for taking the time, man. Real honour and a privilege to have you on the show. Really appreciate it.

So, over 500 club appearances, 49 caps for England and Great Britain, 11 Super League Dream teams, four Challenge Cups, two World's Best Forward awards, one MBE: pretty incredible, man. But I believe like many stories your’s starts in Yorkshire.

Now, if you want to, go back to the beginning and where you grew up, in Leeds if I’m right?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, that's right, yeah, so first of all, it's a pleasure to be here. I'm really looking forward to this.

Yeah, I mean, where's my background?

So, first of all, I'm from Leeds, you know, inner city Leeds, start playing rugby when I was five years of age in my local rugby club Stanningley. My friend at the time brought a letter in, saying the club are looking for players, took the letter round to my dad, next thing you know, I'm playing rugby down there.

And I loved being part of it, I loved being part of the club and part of the community. Things were a lot different back then when they started. I don't think sport was as accessible as it is for younger people nowadays.

I mean, we used to play out of the Waggon And Horses pub in Stanningley, but then over time they managed to get a proper clubhouse and then they built from there and they were a big part of the community. And I know my dad liked going down there because he got to have a few beers on a Wednesday and Saturday, Wednesday when we were training and Saturday or Sunday when we were playing.

And then, you know, from there, I was never particularly great player when I was growing up. I was okay, pretty average. Didn’t make many representative sides, you know, like Leeds, Yorkshire, England, I was never involved in too many of those, hardly any, to be honest.

But I always played sports because I loved it. I loved playing alongside my teammates, liked winning, didn’t so much like losing, but yeah, it's a great grounding is team sport.

RUSSELL BISSET: And what drew you to rugby in the first place? Was it something that was in the family, or was it friends? Like, what was it?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, that's a good question.

So for me, really, you know, my dad played a bit of rugby at school, but I think it was just a chance, you know, the chance to go play it. And then when I got down there, I loved the physical side of it as a younger player.

I used to love tackling, I used to love—I remember I used to love tackling people all the time. Yeah, so I just enjoyed that side of it and then you make - I think with sports, you make great friends with it, you know, going through, you know, good times and bad times and you might not know that, why that bonds relationships when you're younger, but it does, and you understand it when you're older, but that was the attraction for me. You know, the physical side of the game and being around friends and new people.

RUSSELL BISSET: You say that, like, you maybe weren't the best player at that time, but you've gone on to do incredible things, and even amongst what I've just listed there, I think one thing that I probably overlooked slightly is just the impact you had as a leader in the teams that you were in, just incredible, really, and you've gone on to do incredible things as a business mentor and leader in that respect.

Just thinking back to being a kid and first getting into sport, but maybe as you say, like, maybe not being the best, like, have you got any advice for kids thinking about getting into sports?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, for kids getting into sport, I think the first thing is, you've got to enjoy it. You've got to enjoy the sport that you're doing and there's so many different options for you to try nowadays so you should be able to find something that you enjoy doing. I think that's the key component to it.

Then I think, a thing to focus on when you're younger is just be coachable. I think listen to your coach and what they're telling you. Your coach, if you've got a good coach, just wants you to improve. They're not criticising you, they're wanting you to improve and be better at what you're doing.

I think being coachable is good as a junior , but then also, just put a lot of effort into what you're doing, because I think effort and enthusiasm is a choice.

I'd always say to the academy players players on their debut, you know when they play for the first time for the first team, you can see they're really nervous, and rightly so, it's a big moment. They've probably been dreaming of doing that since a five year old, right? And they get to run out for a professional club in the first team and they're playing against a load of hardened men who've done this for a long time.

So you're going to be nervous. But I always used to say to him, look, the only things I want from you is energy and enthusiasm. Like, if you bring effort, energy and enthusiasm, that's enough. You're in charge of those three things. Nobody else is going to decide that by you.

Mistakes? you might make some mistakes, but don't make mistakes around your effort, right? You have to have 100% effort in what you're doing.

I mean, no younger player at a club, they've never got rid of them in a scout meeting instead— said he works too hard, right? No one's ever said that. No one's ever said that when they've got rid of a junior, at any professional sport club, well, he's got too much energy and enthusiasm and he works too hard. That sentence has never been said to a younger player.

So I always think if you can get those things right and be coachable, you'll give yourself a chance in any sport of being successful.

RUSSELL BISSET: Talk about being coachable: I've heard it said a number of times and I reflect on this a bit, like, your first— your first bosses have like, an outsized impact on you in your career.

Do you think, like, is there a coach, like, your first high impact coach and any great lessons or advice that they gave you?

JAMIE PEACOCK: I would agree with that. I think you are right with that. And I think I was fortunate that at the Bradford Bulls when I signed there, there was a number of very good senior players. So there would be, you know, James Low, Brian McDermott, Mike Forshaw, Scott Naylor, Bernard Dwyer, Graham Bradley, there’s six just off the bat, who I recognised had forged a career through hard work.

You know, they might not have been the most talented players. Some exceptionally talented— Jimmy, but Jimmy still worked incredibly hard. These were the guys who are doing extra, that when there's a training session on, they don't give it six out of 10, it's 10 out of 10 and they're trying to push themselves.

So having that core of players around me, when I was, you know, very able to be influenced and just watching them and absorbing it, it made me think, well, I know I'm not— I ain't got bucket loads of natural talent, but I can work hard, you know, and I can consistently work hard and I'm in charge of doing that. So, maybe if they've made it, I've got a chance of doing it, so that really helped me with it.

And I think also then, because they saw myself train hard and apply myself, then I got respect, I think, from them and then it made it easier, my transition into the first team.

RUSSELL BISSET: Amazing.

And we talked a bit about like, childhood growing up and playing for local rugby teams. Maybe by your own assessment, I'm sure others maybe looked at it different given what you've gone on to achieve, but didn't feel like you were the best.

What was the breakthrough moment for you when you started to really accelerate your professional career?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Probably, my breakthrough moment would have been around 18 years of age. You know, everyone get signed a bit younger, 16, 17, but when I was about 18 years of age— first thing Super League started, you know. Super League started, so all these professional clubs started getting academies and became serious around it. There were a lot more scouts out there then. And then what happened for me was, a couple of things: I grew about six inches, I reckon in about a couple of years, that always helps. And then, do you know, a big thing - getting contact lenses. You know, I could see what I was doing, far much easier and I began to really enjoy my rugby.

There was two coaches, Mark Adams and Scott Denovan, who would have been, I think late 20s, early 30s and they were coaching a group of under 18s, so I can imagine it was chaos.

But it was good learning from them, they’d create a good environment, we enjoyed ourselves. We'd win games and we'd go out and celebrate and I was in that great environment and enjoying my rugby.

Super League had started. There was more scouts watching and I was taller and I could see, basically. A few ingredients.

RUSSELL BISSET: That’s real, though, isn't it?

And you've talked— we’ve obviously done a bit of work together, which has been amazing, but you talked a bit about what you call the ‘get off the bus’ moment.

I don't know if you want to talk about that? It's an incredible story.

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, so I think quite often in our lives we will go through moments or have days where we lack self belief, don't we? We have some self doubt or some negative talk.

And my view on that, you know, 20 odd years later later after this incident, 27 years later, is that champions, who back themselves in the big moments, you accept that nerves are part of challenge and change and success.

But when I was 19 years of age, I got a chance to trial at the Bradford Bulls.

So I was really nervous about doing this trial. I was going to train with the first team for the morning to see if I was good enough to earn a contract to play. But I was very nervous about doing it.

So I took the day off work, caught the bus from where I lived in Leeds up to Bradford, you know, eight mile journey, 30 - 40 minutes. On this journey though, my self belief, what little self belief I had, began to evaporate. My negative self thoughts began to get louder and louder to the point that I got to my bus stop and I bottled it.

You know, these thoughts were, I’m going to go train with my heroes, people are watching on TV… It got too much from me, I bottled it and I stayed on the bus.

Now, I stayed on the bus till it terminated, you know, four miles down the road, I got off this bus. Thinking I'd blown my big opportunity. You know, am I going to be a professional rugby league player?

No mobile phones, 1996. So I think, I'll ring my dad, explain what was happening. Hopefully he can help me out. So I rung my dad.

He was pretty pissed with me, you know, taught me some new swear words as I spoke to him…

But he said, I'll give you a chance. I’ll try to speak to the coach and get you a chance the following week, so catch the bus home and we'll have a chat. So that then meant I had two hours of self-reflecting, you know, an hour at a bus stop, an hour on the bus.

And in that period of self-reflection what came to me was, I had a lot of people who actually believed I was good enough, you know the Bradford Bulls scouts did, the coaches did, my dad did, my coaches at Stanningley did. But the one person I had to believe in myself was me.

So I thought, I'm going to come up with a positive mantra, reinforce my self belief. So I came up with the mantra, ‘Time to get off the bus’.

Because in my life I'd have to get off this bus if I got another opportunity.

So anyway, I got home and spoke to my dad and he said, they'll give you one more shot next week, but you don't turn up for that, you know, opportunity to be a professional rugby league player is going to be gone forever.

All week then at work, I tell myself this mantra, time to get off the bus, time to get off the bus, believe in yourself, you’re good enough, you can go do it. Following week I jump on the same bus, still have nerves, but I keep reinforcing this mantra for himself over and over again. Time to get off the bus, Believe yourself, you can do it.

This time, get to my bus stop and I go training with the Bradford Bulls first team. Now, look, it was a tough training session, it's elite sport, but it was nowhere near as bad as I thought it was going to be.

And we all know that, right? When you confront your biggest fears, biggest challenges, they are nowhere near as bad as we think we could be.

So I learned a very pivotal lesson in my life then that with big challenges there will come self doubt. That's part of that process, but you have to believe in yourself, you have to get off the bus, you have to back yourself.

So then that lesson, I used several times throughout my career.

So, you know, first time I got to play for the first team, you know, I used that lesson, you’re going to have to go do it.

Then notably, I used the lesson, the first time I ever got to play against the best team in the world, which was Australia.

So you know, if you don't know Rugby League, they’ve been benchmark for 60 years. 2001, I’m getting in a 24 man squad to play in the Ashes series against Australia.

And it's a huge challenge that. On the Monday of our first first day in camp, the coach brought me in and said I was going to start for the first time for my country, which I thought was great. Thinking to myself, tickets, mum and dad, friends, sisters, everyone's going to come watch me play against the Aussies for Great Britain.

But as I left his hotel room and walked back to mine, because this challenge of playing against the best team in the world, you know, in six days time, on Saturday, was coming up, all negative thoughts— started thinking, I'm not good enough to do this.

I've only played twenty 1st team games. Who do you think you are playing against the best team in the world? So I got back to my hotel room and I was thinking to myself, I'm going to let my country down.

But then I remembered the story again, right, time to get off the bus. So all week at training I told myself, time to get off the bus, you’re good enough to beat the Aussies.

So anyway, the following Saturday we kick off at 6 o’clock. I scored a try on debut against Australians in under 120 seconds. And then we go on and win that game.

So you know, just shows how can use that lesson to push beyond self doubt and negative talk and just back yourself.

RUSSELL BISSET: For someone going through a moment like that, that perhaps has like, past experience when they have pushed through,have you got any advice?
Like, for you, was it really trying to think back to that day and how powerful that was or was it quite literally just that get off the bus mantra that was going through your head?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, I think it's around the first point you make, around using it as a positive anchor.

So I reckon a lot of times we sit on things in our lives that don't go well and we anchor on them, whereas I feel it's better to try and anchor on the things that when you're outside, your comfort zone, you push through it and you do something that you didn't expect that you could do.

Or you plan to do something and it goes exceedingly well, then they're positive anchors and they're things that we should sit on in our lives.

So for me, I had that positive anchor that I got off the bus, got first team contract .

So I know this works for me so I'm going to sit on it again and then it reinforced— added weight to that anchor because it worked again, scored a try, we beat the Australians.

So my advice would be— is to think more about your positive anchors in life and use them, not negative things. And use them to come back to.

RUSSELL BISSET: And then, I mean, what an incredible story.

Does the original, that milestone, pivotal moment, positive anchor does that become your life positive anchor or is it like, is it those big game moments? Does that then kind of supersede it? Do you still think back to that day sometimes?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, for sure. For sure, I think back to that. And I think that moment, or, you know, those two specific moments, then that allowed me to have more of those moments, you know what I mean?

Not every time do I— you know believe in myself and back myself, does it go well. You know, life is not fairy tale.

But the majority of time it does, because I think that key step to high performance or overcoming a big challenge is just you've got to believe in yourself first and that will give yourself every chance of being able to do it. And then it is that almost like self-fulfilling kind of prophecy. You know in yourself that if I get this right from my mind, if I believe myself I give myself every chance of being successful.

It's not guaranteed to happen but it's a strong chance of happening and if it doesn't happen, then I'll learn from why it didn’t happen and I'll factor that in next time.

RUSSELL BISSET: Amazing.

What was it like growing up in the north being like an icon, an incredible athlete in your sport and actually a really northern sport as well.

Did you take a sense of pride from—

JAMIE PEACOCK: I think particularly playing for the Bradford Bulls, we had a sense of pride, because I thought Bradford has struggled at times with its image and I think it was just just off the back of the— it might have been the riots in Manningham, wasn't it, around that point and that's really what Bradford was known for. But I think we were a bit of a shining beacon for the city because we had a period of probably 10 years.

Initially the club were pioneers. They weren't successful, but they were successful off the pitch. They embraced Super League and they were pioneers and you know, the image of a rundown city in the North being the pioneer of summer Super League rugby, yeah, it was incredible.

But then we became successful off the back of it on the pitch and I think every player— you know, when we played for the Bulls, we had that sense of pride, of putting Bradford on the map in the right way, because there's some great areas, some great people in Bradford.

So for me, I probably had a huge amount of pride playing for the Bulls and a huge amount of pride— I’m not from Bradford I’m from Leeds, but I really felt part of putting them on the map in a positive way.

I used to remember when we used to come back from winning at Wembley and we'd be on the back pages of the national papers and thinking, that's the reason why Bradford should be in the papers, not because of some mindless idiots, you know?

RUSSELL BISSET: It’s brilliant man, and you know, as someone that grew up in Bradford, and as you know, like, wasn't really as connected to rugby, my school that I went to, we had AstroTurf pitches, so football was always encouraged. It doesn't really lend itself to it, does it?

But also, you know, so my mum was interviewed on Sky News because it was a BMW garage at the end of our road. We were actually living in Manningham at the time, it was burned down.

So she was on Sky News being interviewed and yeah, very clearly remember that period but even though I wasn't like massively connected to rugby, I did feel that sense of pride, you know, as a Bradfordian about the rugby team and I think, you know, there was something really, really powerful in that man.

JAMIE PEACOCK: I think you've got to realise, not particularly when you're younger, but when you get older, you realise in a sport like Rugby League that's very closely connected to the community, you have a huge impact on people's day to day lives and a lot of people, you know, not everyone, but a lot of people associate with rugby might be in difficult, shit jobs, basically.

You know where you turn up and you earn your money and that’s it and you go home. So your joy in life comes from your sporting team being successful.

You know, you might have joy from your friends and family, but its your sporting team!

RUSSELL BISSET: Dude, you only have to look at the celebrations for Bradford City being promoted this year. Similar thing, right? And just the joy in that city from that promotion was just un-paralleled. It was huge.

JAMIE PEACOCK: It brings like, a moment of magic to mundanity, doesn't it?

You know, like a lot of our lives can be a little bit mundane or— you know, some people work in tough jobs that you want to turn up because you want to get paid. That's a tough existence to keep doing time in, time out.

So you need something that gives you that moment of magic and joy and I think sports teams can be responsible for that more than any other thing, really, I can't think off the top of my head, you know?

That— I feel like I'm a part of this. You know, even like, like music, I love music, it can lift you, but I don't feel like I contribute to Bruce Springsteen's music, right?

RUSSELL BISSET: So growing up, coming from pretty humble beginnings and like, going through your challenges and just achieving so much, are there any like, standout moments that felt like the pinnacle of your career?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, I mean, I think the pinnacle would probably be captaining Great Britain to beat Australia, in Australia.

I grew up watching Great Britain play the Aussies.

I used to love watching those games and I think to go— first of all, captaining your country is such a big honour from coming— if you'd have asked me, you know as a 19 year old on that bus, would I even make it professional, never mind, play for Great Britain, never mind captain your country, you'd have said a definite no.

But then just to, you know, beat the best team in the world in their own country, it was a huge honour, for myself that day and for all the players that played on board and it's the one that sticks with me to this day, you know. It's the only shirt I've got framed is that one and it's just, it was a special day, you know.

it’s disappointing it's not been done since you know, what— we’re bordering on nearly 20 years ago now and that's the last time Great Britain beat Australia so that kind of shows you. I know they've not played each other a lot, but it kind of shows the enormity of that success, I think, that day.

RUSSELL BISSET: We talked a bit about— when we worked together with our team here, celebrating the wins.

How did you personally celebrate that win and make sure, as someone so driven as well, like you didn't just move on to the next thing.

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, we had to celebrate that and you've got to celebrate the wins in life.

Just on that, we— you know, when you have a winning life, you work hard for it and we always, I think how you achieve is you move on too quickly onto what's next and what can I do better rather than just sitting in a moment for a bit and going, well, do you know what? We did a good job and I think the fear is it's going to blunt your edge. But it'll never blunt your edge because you're always going to go to the next thing, you don't recognise it, but, you know, for us, it was a pretty good night.

We had a few beers on the night afterwards and then the Sunday was the big day. We were out on Sunday in Manley, which was great. Whole team out together and I think my last kind of memory was me and John Wilkin, I think Paul Wellens was with us, singing the National Anthem in one of the pubs in Manley about midnight on the Sunday.

But for me, you know, I was done with it then. The next Monday I was on trying, we had New Zealand next, trying to beat them, but unfortunately, I think a few of the players that day, they were still stuck in that moment, couldn't move on quick enough.

We didn't deliver the best of performances against New Zealand collectively afterwards, which is a shame.

RUSSELL BISSET: How do you pick yourself back up when you go through those highs and lows like that?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, that's a good question.

I think when you have a real high, I think there's a couple of things that you've got to, first of all, recognise it and enjoy it, right? That's part of the moving on from it. Work out what went well, as well, with it.

And then I think it's accepting that there will be a bit of a lull in the couple of days afterwards that you might have a bit of, well, what's the point, what are we going to do next, you know?

But then I think you've got to quickly get to, right, okay, where's the next goal Where are we're going to next?

We recognise, we’ve celebrated the moment. We've recognised what we could do better. We've realised it's a bit of a lull and then, right, what's next, and how do we move on? Reset your goal again, try to be better again off the back of it.

RUSSELL BISSET: Amazing.

So, as someone that's an inspiration to so many, whether it was your professional sport and career, you know, your career after that as a motivational speaker, leadership coach, wellness expert, what's your perfect day look like, man? What's the day well spent?

JAMIE PEACOCK: I’ve been sweating this question, waiting on you asking me this!

RUSSELL BISSET: It’s good one!

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, it's a big, big question this. So, right, I'll try to get this right.

So for me, the first thing would be, I'd be up early. I'm an early riser and I'd be up doing a tough like, group kind of cross-fit Hyrox workout that’s— we're into an hour you know, it's going to be an hour long. With some good people around who are all gonna, I want to be around people who are going to give it a crack, you know, like, so we're going to send it and like bury ourselves on this. And I just want that feeling of like pushing hard together, you know, outside our comfort zone in that hurt locker, feeling the pain together, you know, because it's such a good feeling when you're doing it with other people, right?

I can do it on my own, but I know it's more enjoyable with a group. And that's the thing I miss about playing professional sport, that pushing through pain and discomfort together to share an accomplished goal. The closest I get to that is a kind of workout together.

So that's how I'll be starting my day, with that.

And then from that, this— I would really like to have a pretty like, hour-long chilled breakfast, but it would be around, somewhere around Cornwall, you know, like… But it's not— it's more of like, a September morning, the sun's rising, you know, and it's bright, but it's not baking hot. Do you know what I mean? It's just, it's like…

RUSSELL BISSET: How many degrees are we talking?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, we're talking like, in the mid-teens so you can wear shorts, but you need a jumper and that on.

And just taking in maybe like, just round St. Ives or somewhere like that, just like somewhere just sat with— and yeah, with people close to me but then next bit would be I'd love—

RUSSELL BISSET: What are you eating, man? We've got to know that. And like I guess the key thing I was interested in, in having this conversation or thinking about it was like, is the perfect day for you, is it like, is it the perfect day for kind of high impact, as it were, and wellness, or is it like, when you think of the perfect day, you like, well you've already kind of answered that, but you're not like, going to lie on the couch for a day and eat pizza are you, clearly because that just that’s—

JAMIE PEACOCK: No, so it's doing the right activity with the right people in the right situation. It's a day full of that. I reckon that's where the magic happens in our lives, when we're with the right people doing the right activity in the right situation and that's when you get— I think you get the most joy or fulfilment out of life, in our lives. So my day is going to be packed full of doing that.

So I'll be having like, breakfast with Sarah, my partner, because we have— we're both early risers and we both like a good crack, laugh in the morning. And my breakfast would be like a kind of healthy English, full English— I had one the other day actually at Loaf in Headingley and it was amazing. It was really like all proper home made. They did an amazing job of it so it's going to be that.

RUSSELL BISSET: What, are you talking black pudding, like just the works?

JAMIE PEACOCK: I mean I've earned it!

RUSSELL BISSET: Yeah! Yeah!

JAMIE PEACOCK: I mean we've earned it. We've burnt a thousand calories. We're in, you know It's already paid for breakfast, both cash and like, calorie-wise.

Then I would like to spend a bit of time, body boarding with my children.

Like Louis, he's 20, Lily’s 16 and Freya’s 14 and I think the one activity I've enjoyed doing with them the most and one that I think they enjoyed doing is like bodyboarding, like down in Mawgan Porth and it's pretty quiet, right? That's it.

There's not loads of people there. It's quiet in the morning and like a couple of hours doing that for me would just be— because you just— everyone's present, there's no mobile phones, it's just you've got to concentrate on what you're doing a bit.

RUSSELL BISSET: It’s the benefit of water, isn't it? Just about everything else these days, you’re gonna have a mobile phone and somewhere, but yeah, water rules that out doesn’t it. It's great for that.

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah.

And then from there I'd like to go for a bit of a longish lunch. You know where you have a long couple of hours lunch with some close friends and family just enjoying— a little bit like, I go skiing and we have like, long lunches there like they’re a couple of hours long and I really enjoy that part of just sat around with people.

RUSSELL BISSET: What kind of— are you doing like, small plates? You talked about like, having a long lunch, that kind of, that feels like that for me…
JAMIE PEACOCK: yeah yeah, small plates, so I'm starting off with a few small plates. Starters, your main and then a bit of dessert for everyone to share.

There's a few wines going on, but not too many with that, just a nice couple with it.

And then my afternoon would be like a hike, a bit of a hike, again with people who are close to me, up in Cumbria. You know, probably Striding Edge, try to knock Striding Edge out in like, could do that in four hours.

RUSSELL BISSET: So, well, yeah, just to back track slightly so I mean, this sounds like an incredible perfect day, to be honest, but it's super active. So post like, your professional days, how important to you is exercise and movement?

JAMIE PEACOCK: It’s just, it's like non-negotiable. It is non-negotiable is exercise for me.

I have to do some form of exercise and I like to base activities around exercise whether, you know, that's CrossFitting, Hyrox, running, gym, like skiing, whatever. Do you know, I'll find some— hiking.

I just I want to be around people who like that as well, with it. I want to be around like minded people who will see the benefits of doing that.

I think we think differently when we sweat, you know and when we're moving, we just, you know, we're meant to move, we're not meant to sat down, we're not meant to— we're meant to move. So for me, I think that's been a huge part of me being able to move past my rugby career pretty quickly, because I’ve just thrown myself into marathon running, ultra running, and like Hyroxing and CrossFitting and learning new skills and skiing, all these kind of things.

Anything that I could do and try and learn how to do.

RUSSELL BISSET: And do you still compete when you do like Hyrox, for example?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, I'd love to be a bit younger, but I realise I'm trying to, with it. But yeah, I go alright for my age group with these kind of things, with that.

So me and a guy, Johnny Miller with Podium, you know, top three for our age group, on a doubles Hyrox.

But yeah, I just like pushing myself hard, I just like, I like to compete with myself, you know. And then I think I'm a bit of like, an intensity bomb because I'll train hard, you know. Majority of the time I'll train like, like this is last training session over, you know?

So, yeah, I’ll give it a good crack, with it. And I think that pushes other people to train hard too.

RUSSELL BISSET: So we're up Striding Edge, one of the most beautiful hikes in the north, I reckon. So do you say Helvellyn and Striding Edge?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, that's it. We're doing that, but it’s an autumn evening, so it's light and sunny, but it's getting towards twilight, you know, so you're getting all that pink and blue everywhere and you're going to need headlights just for the last little bit coming down, on that.

But then the final part is, there is— I really like a pub in a Grasmere called Tweedies. And I like Tweedies just because it’s— I've got a good memories associated with it, but probably only get about 50 - 60 people in there, that might be in my mind.

It's got a good open fireplace. It's got stone in there. And the next, the best part of the evening, there's 50 - 60 of my favourite people in there, there's live music playing, and it's just like a pub atmosphere from 7 till closing order at— 11 o’clock, I’ll be done. Nothing good happens to me after midnight being like, early 50s, so 11 o'clock the last kind of thing and that being the end of the day, the final part of it, in there.

RUSSELL BISSET: That’s funny you say that. I've got a policy myself where I'm pretty sure when I was younger, it was pretty late, like nothing good happens after, it must have been 2 - 3am. I must remember that, and it just gets earlier and earlier as the years go on.

But yeah, I think I'm similar. 12 is probably my limit these days.

You talk a bit about music, about— you mentioned Bruce Springsteen. What are you training to?

JAMIE PEACOCK: I’m really, last four or five years, I just got into country music. Can't stop listening to country music at a moment.

Just because, I was really into like Springsteen and then I loved David Bowie. But I'm always after new music and I've fall down, like, what— listened to a bit of country anyway, like Johnny Cash. I love Johnny Cash, I listened to him. But then I started— what did I start listening to?

So I started through a bit of Yellowstone, listened to Ryan Bingham who's on Yellowstone then went to listen to Zach Bryan and then from there it's just opened right out.

I'm like fully kind of into like, country folk music so…

RUSSELL BISSET: There’s a great guy from Leeds (bit of an aside really) called Sam Barrett. Serious Sam Barrett. But he does like, kind of Americana, slightly country music. I'll send you a link to it man, it's class.

So does that answer a bit the question around like, what's the band playing when you go to the pub? are they…

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, Americana, they’re nailing Americana songs, yeah, just good solid Bruce Springsteen in there, bit of David Bowie and they’re nailing like, Americana and it’s just getting people up and moving and dancing. Bit like a band you'd see in like Dublin here, but really class one, you know what?

RUSSELL BISSET: Sounds amazing.

And what are you eating at the pub? It's been a pretty filling day, I would say so no, fucking earned it, man, yeah!

But yeah, what would you eat? What's the ultimate pub meal?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Well, done really well, I don't think you can beat sausage and mash with Yorkshire pudding but it's got to be done really well, you know? So that'd be me, I think that'd be it. Definitely like.

RUSSELL BISSET: Pints of cask beer are we saying?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, no, not cask, more pale ales, like a few pale ales.

But yeah, and then get to that, you know, that golden hour when you've had about, for me, three or four beers and you’re just really, everyone’s in that kind of— it's got to stay that golden hour stage for like two or three hours where you're lively but you're not over the edge and everyone's having a good time you know that sweet spot.

RUSSELL BISSET: Thinking back to you know as a kid that maybe, I’m paraphrasing it, but hopefully right in like, maybe not lack of confidence but a bit nervous about stepping off the bus as you said yourself and thinking back to what you went through.

What do you think, what do you think that kid would think of what you've been through in that perfect day as it is now? Do you think that's changed over the years, huh?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, I just, yeah, that's a great question.

What would they, what would I think back then?

I don't think that person would have, me back then then, would have believed, you know, the journey I've been on as a person.

I’ve not just been on a journey of learning more confidence and being resilient, I had a great rugby career, but I think I have been on a journey as a person as well over the last, what, 20, 30 years since that day as well.

So I think if I've told them everything I'd done, I think they'd be excited by what's coming out in front for the rest of their lives. So, yeah, I'm sure they'd be looking forward to seeing what that journey's going to be for the next 28, 30 years.

RUSSELL BISSET: Amazing, man. You talk a bit like this perfect day is high impact like, yeah, it sounds incredible to me. I would probably echo so much of that.

But how do you relax? How do you wind down?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, that's a good question.

So I like being out in nature, I think when you're out in nature or doing an activity—I find it really hard to have a beach holiday, me. After about two, three days, my gears are going in my head, so I need to be out. The way I relax is through training or through hiking or being in nature. I do like relaxing, having a few beers, you know, that takes my mind off it as well, with it. So they're the kind of things I like doing, with it. I'm not like, sit and watch TV kinda…

RUSSELL BISSET: I struggle as well.

That's why I'm interested in like, the talk about the rest and digest, the parasympathetic state. It's like allowing those moments so you can recharge and go again, right? So important.

JAMIE PEACOCK: You’ve got to create space for that. Yeah, you can't always be on, right? And you've got to work out how you're not on, right? That's the key with it, isn't it?

RUSSELL BISSET: You think nature plays a big role?

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, I think, I know I get far more enjoyment running through woods, than running on a street and like hiking, you get so much enjoyment out of hiking and seeing, taking it all in. You know, it's just, yeah, we're designed to be there, aren't we?

RUSSELL BISSET: 100%.

Perfect day again like, sounds incredible, but you've had like, moments in life that very, very few people on this earth will will get in terms of the magnitude of achievement.

How do you get that buzz these days? Are you at peace with the journey? Do you find those moments still in your day to day?

Yeah, so you'll answer that. I'm at peace with my journey.

I understand that my exceptionally high moments of incredible high achievement, they might not come around again. You know, I'm okay with that. I probably have more than most would have in a lifetime. I'm happy with that.

My aim in life is to do what I come back to, the three things, more of: right people, right situation, right activity.

And that's how I get my kind of enjoyment out of life. You can't do it all the time. It's not guaranteed you get your joy and fulfilment out of it, but I want to stack the cards in my favour, so I've got a good eye on what that looks like for me and I try to work hard so I can spend time doing that. That's my kind of purpose around that.

RUSSELL BISSET: Amazing.

And so we talked about the perfect day and as someone, again, you know, who’s achieved so much, is there— if you put aside the perfect day, if you do focus on the high impact day, and we've talked in the past about these moments when you've gone the extra mile and you've eaten broccoli for breakfast every day.

Are there any like, habits or things that you do to give you the best chance of success day to day, whether it's like types of food or like…

JAMIE PEACOCK: Yeah, I got a few kind of micro-habits going on, I think that kind of work for me.

I mean, a big believer in going to bed early, getting up early. I think that has a big impact on you and trying to create right sleeping environment for yourself in your room and everyone's talking about this.

But it's true, right? Sleep in a dark room, no distractions in there and it's just going there to go to sleep. And I think creating that has a huge impact, on you as a person with the right amount of sleep.

If you think of when you've had a great night's sleep, how easy is the world to deal with right? It’s really easy. So why would you not invest time in doing that?

Then, you know, I always wake up to like a litre of electrolytes, take some different vitamins and minerals. I stretch now for 15 minutes each morning, then I do ideally like to get into doing some activity. I need to do an activity in the morning to get myself up and running with it.

I try and eat a breakfast of Greek yoghurt, low fat one with plenty of fruit in it, lots of protein, low calorie, got lots of fruit in it, so you've nearly got your five-a-day straight away.

And then I'm a big believer in, at the end of the day, you know, when I’ve finished my work, is writing down, you know, what's gone well, what could I have done better and then planning my next day around that too, as well with it?

So those kind of things work for me. They're just like little micro things that work. Making sure I drink enough water as well, along the way. And they like, they're all common sense, but common sense is not common practice.I try and make them common practice.

RUSSELL BISSET: 100%.

You've obviously shared some of the things that have worked really well for you over the years, but is there like one piece of advice? We've talked a bit about like micro habits. We've talked a bit about self-talk. Like, if there was one thing amongst all of those habits and things to facilitate a life really well lived.

Is there one thing, one piece of advice you’d give?

JAMIE PEACOCK: That’s a tough question. One piece of advice I’d give…

I just think, you know, the one thing we're in charge of each day, right? And I believe this honestly, is giving your best.

And I think you need to remind yourself of that each day, is that you ultimately will decide whether you give your best in whatever you do, whatever that's being a parent or being a good friend, or being good at work or sporting an activity. Just remind yourself of that every day.

Like, I'm going to be in charge of this today, I'm going to be in charge of giving my best in whatever I do. I understand that not every day you'll reach it, but every day should have the intention to do it and if you give yourself the intention of doing that every day and everything you do, you'll have far more good days than bad days, I think, with it. And it's a pretty simple thing.

RUSSELL BISSET: Amazing.

What's next for you, man?

JAMIE PEACOCK: What’s next for me? Right, well, I need to get my knee fixed because it’s stopping training as hard, but yeah, just living life, you know, enjoying life, making the most out of it.

My dad died 10 years older than I am now. But, you know, he was a heavy smoker, smoked 46 a day, worked in a dusty environment and died of lung cancer. But you know, that kind of narrows your focus a little bit because when he passed away and he was— he got diagnosed at 56, died at 58. When he got diagnosed, I was in my early 30s and I thought, well, he's old, like mid 50s, but as I'm like 47 or 48 now mid 50s is not old.

So you've got so much to offer the world and so much to do. So mine's just trying to give my best each day and try and make the most out of my life. You know, that's the key with it.

RUSSELL BISSET: And you said that, I guess just to track back one final time to that day when you got off the bus and that conversation with your dad, like, what was— remind me, what was his advice to you then that really stuck with you? Yeah, what did he say?

JAMIE PEACOCK: I think it's not his advice, it’s the fact that he backed me. But I think that's the biggest thing that, you know what? He gave me— my dad backed me and wanted to get me a second chance, you know, within that.

So I think that's the biggest thing I get out of that because I think maybe that's what parents are about, that your kids aren’t always going to get it right. And sometimes you’re there to bollock them. And I got a bollocking right, but then you're there to try and give them the chance to get it right.

You know, you can't give them too many chances, but everyone should maybe get a second chance, maybe through that parent. I think that's my take out from that.

RUSSELL BISSET: So there you have it, Jamie Peacock Fresh From The North.

What an incredibly humble but brilliant and inspiring human and an incredible story, you know.

He's so gracious with it. And thank you, thanks to him so much for his time.

And thanks for listening along. I hope you've got something from it. I certainly did. Yeah, thanks.

See you next time. Fresh From The North.